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Norrin Radd · 11-06-2009, 08:07 PM

This is getting close to a flame war, so I'll tell everyone to chill out.

This is about aliens, not religion. Discuss thusly.

hobosexual · 11-06-2009, 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by V-Opolis

whos to say they can live off other building blocks? all you guys have for aliens existing is faith...sound familiar?

Hardly, logic and probability is more like it.

Ordinary · 11-07-2009, 02:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Claudezero

im sure there are aliens, afterall if bacteria can exist, indefintely can liveforms exist. and ill tell ya we have found bacteria on other planets here in this system, but... they were dead.

Haven't read all the posts yet blah blah blah, but I'll answer this because it caught my eye.

No...no...no...no...no...one thousand times no.

We have not found evidence of life anywhere outside of Earth. Sorry.

Quote:

Originally Posted by IronyTaken

Like I said we have hundreds of billions of galaxies.

We have more than 100 billion tries if you want to say only one planet per galaxy can have the ability to produce life. And each galaxy has billions of stars.

We know that life evolved over time to adapt to it's environment. And that is why life is the way it is here. We have certain pressures exerted to us on our environment and we must be able to survive those pressures so we adapt.

To say that life needs to be this way or that way to survive is based on a narrow minded assumption of what we can only see on earth.

The single celled organisms that inhabited this earth a few billion years ago took over 1 billion years to develop into anything more complex. It took many trials of reproduction for it to get it right. It may have seemed impossible if they only got a few tries but they had billions upon billions upon billions of tries over a span of a billion years to get it right.

What if the organism that arose on a different planet formed differently based on the environment of that planet.

We know that certain organisms can survive temperatures of up to 284 degrees Fahrenheit and temperatures close to absolute zero.

And all the different chemicals you see here in the universe once began as only hydrogen. And with time we got all of what we see today.

There are so many unknowns that it would be hard to even make an educated guess but anyone who is trying to act certain on this matter is too full of himself.

You have to be pretty ignorant to say that our planet is the only one capable of life even within our own galaxy. We have barely even explored our own galaxy when talking about looking for planets that are habitable for our types of life.

Guess I'll tackle this since it's directed at me.

First of all, the chance yet again...is one in some ungodly large number, most definitely not in the billions or even trillions, did you read my post?

With your argument of "many trials of reproduction" you are effectively saying life started more than once. It's already a mathematical improbability that it happened once...but you say it happened thousands of times?

I think you fair to under stand that if the first life failed, then it dies out. Then new life would have to form mysteriously on it's own...without the lessons of the past life, I don't think ghost bacteria would come back to warn the new bacteria about the environment

.

We have no evidence that life forms any differently than on Earth, you're making assumptions and I would prefer we keep this simply a factual debate. 284 degrees and 0 degrees are not at all extremes we see in the universe. In fact, Earth has the most stable orbit with the most stable climate of any planet that we have observed, we are quite the exception.

I am not being full of myself at all by saying I'm certain...there's simply no factual evidence to say that there is life outside of Earth. The evidence is highly in favor of their being no other life in the universe.

Quote:

Originally Posted by hobosexual

Hardly, logic and probability is more like it.

What's your logical argument saying that life would be any different than what it is here? You can't throw random probability and logic on something and call it true. Give us some facts and evidence.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Norrin Radd

By the very nature of infinity, to deny the existence of aliens is ridiculous.

If there was only one variable for the formation of life then this would be true. But for so many variables to come together perfectly? It's amazing it happened once.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Norrin Radd

This is getting close to a flame war, so I'll tell everyone to chill out.

This is about aliens, not religion. Discuss thusly.

I'm pretty proud of myself for keeping Religion out of it, so far.

KunaiBlood · 11-07-2009, 04:32 AM

Think about it, theirs billions upon billions of galaxies in our universe alone, each galaxy holds at least 100billion stars each. And each star can have planets. So the probability of of us being alone in our universe its statistically improbable. Whether they are intelligent lifeforms or simple bacteria we don't truly know.

tarozeero · 11-07-2009, 04:53 AM

can you please stop making these threads already? NO ONE can say if aliens exist or not because simply, it has not been proven yet.

Ordinary · 11-07-2009, 04:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KunaiBlood

Think about it, theirs billions upon billions of galaxies in our universe alone, each galaxy holds at least 100billion stars each. And each star can have planets. So the probability of of us being alone in our universe its statistically improbable. Whether they are intelligent lifeforms or simple bacteria we don't truly know.

And again, you fail to understand just how many variables factor into life being about to survive on this planet.

Let's just take 2.

First of all, any Earth size planet would either be a water world or a desert. In fact, formations of planets with large amounts of water and land is virtually impossible, it should not happen, this is according to scientists, not me.

The gravity of a planet our size would prevent the formation of mountains and continents. In a waterworld, all the land would be eroded in a rather short period of time, but we have tectonic activity which is caused by our very unique moon.

The second thing we can look at is a Jupiter sized planet 5 AU from it's star. If a planet did not have a planet this large then life would NOT exist. Jupiter is responsible for water arriving on Earth (best hypothesis and generally accepted way) and is very likely to have caused the small planet like collided with us to form the moon.

Jupiter is now effectively being our shield from space debris, without we would see 1,000-10,000 times more impacts. We have found 31 "Jupiter like planets" so far. Out of all of those none are anywhere near 5 AU from it's star, it is much closer which completely ruins the habitable zone. "Jupiters" are rare events in the universe and ours is the only one we know of that is "good".

Quote:

Originally Posted by tarozeero

can you please stop making these threads already? NO ONE can say if aliens exist or not because simply, it has not been proven yet.

We can make educated guesses based on evidence. Plus, a good friendly debate is always fun.

jazneo · 11-07-2009, 05:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tarozeero

can you please stop making these threads already? NO ONE can say if aliens exist or not because simply, it has not been proven yet.

that what you think. but there is evidence. just people ignore because they think it cant happien.

http://ancientpuzzles.blogspot.com/

Ordinary · 11-07-2009, 05:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jazneo

that what you think. but there is evidence. just people ignore because they think it cant happien.

http://ancientpuzzles.blogspot.com/

You can't be serious.

Norrin Radd · 11-07-2009, 06:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ordinary

If there was only one variable for the formation of life then this would be true. But for so many variables to come together perfectly? It's amazing it happened once.

I'm pretty proud of myself for keeping Religion out of it, so far.

...and by the nature of infinity, it would happen again.

If space and time are infinite, and infinite is defined as we know...then there's not really any other solution.

Ordinary · 11-07-2009, 06:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Norrin Radd

...and by the nature of infinity, it would happen again.

If space and time are infinite, and infinite is defined as we know...then there's not really any other solution.

Space is not infinite, your error lies there, sir.

11-07-2009, 04:32 AM	#44 (permalink)
KunaiBlood Dixie Banana Bar Join Date: May 2006 Location: I forgot mines can i have yours? Posts: 287 Reputation: 10	Think about it, theirs billions upon billions of galaxies in our universe alone, each galaxy holds at least 100billion stars each. And each star can have planets. So the probability of of us being alone in our universe its statistically improbable. Whether they are intelligent lifeforms or simple bacteria we don't truly know. __________________

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11-06-2009, 08:07 PM	#41 (permalink)
Norrin Radd Banned Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Space Posts: 9,541 Reputation: 235	This is getting close to a flame war, so I'll tell everyone to chill out. This is about aliens, not religion. Discuss thusly.

11-07-2009, 04:53 AM	#45 (permalink)
tarozeero Chrono's Crony Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 3,393 Reputation: 19	can you please stop making these threads already? NO ONE can say if aliens exist or not because simply, it has not been proven yet.