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Thread: Gunbound Delay Guide

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    Default Gunbound Delay Guide

    Delay Guide
    Another long thingy by CreeDo
    ================================================== ==============================
    If anyone wishes to repost this guide, do not alter or remove any portion of it.
    It is only to be reposted in full, with credit to the original author (CreeDo).
    ================================================== ==============================

    Delay is important, and a lot of players who seem pro don't really
    get it. There are times where playing delay intelligently will make
    up for having crappy aim... or looking at it another way, you could
    have the best aim in the world but still lose a game because you
    didn't play delay correctly.
    So here's how to use it. (skip to the last part for the good stuff).

    Delay Basics

    Whenever you shoot, you use up delay. You can think of each shot
    using up time, and some bots use less time to shoot than others.
    To make things easy, let's call the time units used "ms" for
    'milleseconds'. The shot speed isn't really measured this way but
    it's easy to type ms.

    Stronger shots will use more delay, and anything else you do during
    your turn also uses up a bit of delay (moving, sitting there, charging
    your power bar, changing angle). The time you spend doing these
    things is what uses up your delay, it doesn't really matter how much
    you move or how many angles you change, the point is that doing these
    things eats up seconds of your shot clock, and when you finally shoot
    all of these wasted seconds will be added to your shot's delay to give
    you the final delay number. The amount added is 10 ms for every
    second you waste. For turtle, the amount added is 12 ms.

    Some pretty typical delay figures:

    Shot 1: 750 ms
    Shot 2: 900 ms
    SS: 1,300 ms

    So what does that mean? Well since this is a turn based game, things
    that could be happening at the same time are shown 1 turn at a time.
    So for example, let's say I am mage, and my shot 1 is 750 ms. You
    are bo****, your shot 1 is only 730 ms. If we both fire at exactly
    the same time, bo**** 'reloads' first and can fire another shot before
    mage can. What you see in the game would be like this...
    At the bottom left is a turn list, with the delay for each shot shown
    next to the shooter's name. Then the delay of other mobiles is shown
    next to theirs, and to make things easy the game simply shows you how
    much faster or slower the enemy's shot was compared to yours. For
    example if the enemy's delay for their shot was 10 ms faster than
    yours, you will see "-10" next to their name. If it's 20 ms slower,
    you'd see "+20" next to their name. If it was the exact same, you
    see +0 or -0.

    So in the example of mage vs bo****, the game decides randomly who
    is shooting first.

    1. Mage's turn, shot 1 is fired... delay list shows:
    Mage 750
    Bo**** 0

    You just fired and used up 750 ms, bo**** hasn't shot so his delay is
    0 and that means he's ready to shoot immediately.

    2. Bo****'s turn, shot 1 is fired... delay list shows:
    Bo**** 730
    Mage +20

    Your delay is 20 faster than mage's, so the list shows +20. Any time
    the list shows a + number, the enemy with the + number will go after
    you do. Enemies with a - number go before you.

    3. Bo****'s turn again, shot 1 is fired... delay list shows:
    Bo****: 730
    Mage -710

    Your shot is once again 730 ms, but now notice the mage is now -710.
    After the mage and bo**** both shot 1 time, the delay was almost
    perfectly even... with bo**** having a bit of an edge. That 20 ms
    'edge' is subtracted from bo****'s shot delay. You can think of it
    this way, if turn 3 happened with mage and bo**** being perfectly
    even, then bo****'s shot 1 would eat up 730 ms, and that means mage
    has 730 ms of advantage time on the bo****. But because mage was
    already at a 20 ms disadvantage from the 2nd turn, mage is only
    getting 710 ms of advantage (which is still a lot).

    How Delay Affects Turns

    The start of the match is the time when delay can really screw up the
    turn order and rearrange who goes first on the turn list.
    That's because the people shooting first will eat up big delay and
    the people shooting later can see how fast they shot, then try to use
    up even less delay. If the player shooting second manages to use
    less delay than the player shooting first, that player will get to
    go again. You might think "but that's cheap, that means going second
    might mean you get 2 turns in a row, which is a big advantage!"
    ...that's true, but there's more to it than that.
    In the end, if you play correctly and intelligently, the delay is
    almost always fair. I'll try to explain why.

    If you go first, you're giving up 750 delay because you fired a shot.
    But it's a tradeoff, in return you're getting damage on the enemy IF
    you didn't miss. The tradeoff is worth it if you get full damage from
    your shot 1, because some mobiles can kill enemies with 2 duals
    and 1 extra shot. Your opening shot 1 is the '1 extra shot' you need.
    If it hits, you can be assured that two duals will allow you to win.
    Even if you cannot kill, the damage advantage matters. You may wear
    them down to a point where 1 more dual will kill them... before they
    can do the same to you.

    On the other hand, if you go second, you can often steal that extra
    turn by firing your shot 1 faster than the enemy shot his. Then on
    your next turn you can do whatever you want. But! I said the delay
    system was fair didn't I? What happens in these situations where
    you've 'stolen' a free turn is you're forced to use another weak
    shot 1. Let's say you don't, you decide to get aggressive and use
    shot 2. Then the delay list will often look something like this:
    Your shot 2: 900
    Enemy's delay: -880

    Now the enemy has an 880 delay advantage on you. That's more than
    enough time for him to fire a shot 1, then steal an extra turn on YOU.
    After he does a shot 1 here, the delay list will look like this:
    Enemy: 750
    Your delay: -130

    It's almost back to square 1, but the enemy is going again with a 130
    delay advantage on you. If he fires a shot 2 with his 'stolen' turn:
    Enemy: 900
    Your delay: -770

    Now you've got a 770 delay advantage. If you fire super fast, you
    can get two turns in a row... by now you see the pattern.
    Basically if you steal an extra turn on the enemy and then use
    anything except a fast shot 1, you're giving up 2 turns in a row to
    him. Then if he uses up shot 2 during his extra turn, he's giving up
    two turns to you... and back and forth like that until one of you
    drops dead. The only way to avoid the constant stolen-turn pattern
    is to have both players use as little delay as possible and use only
    shot 1 back and forth. But people get bored doing that and always
    end up screwing up by switching to shot two before they should.. or
    worse, using an item too early.

    The bottom line: It really doesn't matter whether you go first or
    second, because in the end it all evens out. The important thing is
    to use delay as intelligently as you can, and of course don't miss icon_biggrin.gif
    The examples I give are 1v1 type situations, but delay applies to
    every game, by using delay carefully you might jump several places
    in the turn list. For example in a 4v4 game, many times you'll see
    that just choosing shot 1 instead of shot 2 can change whether you go
    after all the enemies, or after only 2 of them (and before the others).
    Delay also affects whether you go before a teammate or not, which
    means you can get a kill before they have a chance to take it icon_biggrin.gif

    To be fair, I should add this warning:
    There are a few very rare situations where because of weather, or a
    weakness to a certain weapon... it's a disadvantage to go second
    because the enemy can kill you in 2 turns, and you can't kill them
    in 2 turns. Probably the only time you'll see this happen is in
    a bo**** vs a.sate match. Bo**** is weak to lasers and has low
    defense in general, sate happens to have a very strong SS that can
    wipe out half of bo****'s life without using up as much delay as it
    ought to. So if the sate goes first, he will SS bo****, wipe out
    half of your life, then bo**** gets two turns. Bo**** might do a lot
    of damage during those 2 turns, but he won't be able to kill sate.
    When sate's next turn finally comes up, he can dual and kill bo****.
    Outside of this ONE sad situation, delay is generally fair.

    Items + Delay

    Items add to your delay, so you must use them carefully. If you
    use an item at the wrong time, you'll use up so much delay that the
    enemy will get 2 turns in a row on you. Different items add different
    amounts of delay to your shot, and the most popular items are usually
    the ones that add the most delay (because they're the most powerful).
    Items that don't affect your delay a lot, so don't worry about it:
    Blood (0 delay added)
    Bunge (+50)
    Small Heal (+50)
    Powerup (+80)
    Wind Change (+100)

    Items that add a bit more delay:
    Thunderbolt (+200)
    Large Heal (+200)

    Items that add so much delay you must be careful to avoid giving
    up an extra turn to the enemy:
    Dual+ (+250)
    Dual (+650)

    Basically, use the minor powerups any time and don't sweat delay
    too much, unless it's your first shot of the game. For the important,
    powerful items like dual and dual+, you need to watch delay carefully.
    In most situations these will give the enemy 2 turns in a row on you.

    Avatar and Delay

    This section is going to be short: Your delay is about half
    'base delay' and half shot delay. What's that mean? It means that
    avatars that reduce your delay are a ripoff because they only reduce
    your shot delay, not your base delay. That means that avatars
    that SHOULD reduce your delay by 50% actually only reduce it by
    half of that, i.e. 25%. The best possible delay suit will be useless
    vs a good attack or defense suit, so don't waste money buying it.

    Delay Tricks

    If you don't get delay yet, you're probably screwed. Read this stuff
    anyway and you might avoid doing dumb things.

    *At the start of the game, everyone who goes after you will have the
    chance to shoot faster than you and steal a turn on you. So you want
    to shoot as quickly as you can. That means using shot 1, and not
    wasting a whole lot of time moving or aiming. Some mobiles have a
    naturally slow shot 1, like armor and nak... so no matter how fast you
    shoot, sometimes the enemy will get 2 turns in a row on you. Don't
    worry about that. If you read section 2, you'll know that 'extra'
    turn isn't really for free, and shouldn't be a big deal.

    *Also at the start of the game, if you go after the enemy you want
    to shoot at, you should try to beat their delay by shooting as quickly
    as you can. Also, be aware that you don't HAVE to beat their delay
    with a weak shot 1 every time. You want to use the strongest shot
    you can that will still be faster than whatever they used. For
    example, if they used shot 1, only your shot 1 can beat their delay.
    But if they used shot 2, you might be able to beat their delay by
    using your own shot 2 and just using less time to aim and fire.
    By knowing every mobile's exact delay numbers, you can be aware of
    important little differences like the fact that even a slow shot 2
    from bo**** will have less delay than a fast shot 2 from armor.

    *If the enemy uses an item as their first shot, you can strike back
    hard and still beat their delay and get 2 turns in a row. Even
    if they don't use an item, watch what shot they do use and try to
    hit back with whatever shot will beat their delay and do good damage.
    Here is a list of the relative 'speed' of each shot:

    If they: ..........|........ You should:
    Dual (~1550 delay).|.S.S. or Dual+ (or dual faster)
    S.S. (~1300 delay).|.........Dual+ (or S.S. faster)
    Dual+(~1000 delay).|.........Shot2 (or dual+ faster)
    Shot2(~ 900 delay).|.........Shot1 (or shot2 faster)
    Shot1(~ 750 delay).|.........Shot1 faster

    *When using dual+, the +250 delay for the item is added to whichever
    shot you choose to fire first. So if you use dual+, it's almost
    always better to use shot 1 first so that you get the best delay
    possible. Don't listen to anyone who says doing shot 2 first is
    stronger or something, the damage is the same... so just use 1 first.

    *Use the lowest delay shot you can to kill enemies who are nearly
    dead. Don't waste a dual on a very weak enemy if shot 1 or shot 2
    will do. You might think it looks cool or you might like earning
    a few extra bucks, but the wasted delay DOES hurt you in the long
    run by costing you turns later on. It can even cost you the game.

    *You can use the numbers on the delay list to tell you when using
    a dual+, dual, etc is safe (i.e. won't give the enemy 2 turns in a row)
    Generally, if the enemy's delay is +300 or higher compared to you,
    then it's safe to use dual+. If their delay is +700 or higher, then
    it's safe to use a dual. If you see +800, you can usually fire a
    shot 1 and steal an extra turn. +1000 is a safe time to shot 2.
    +1100 is a safe time to dual+, +1400 to SS, +1600 means you can dual
    quickly and still go before your enemy.
    You can study each mobile's delay stats to know the exact amount of
    advantage you need to fire each of your weapons, some situations are
    very close... for example +780, is it enough time to steal a turn
    using Armor's shot 1 or not? See the next point.

    *The exact mobile delay is listed below, memorize it not just for
    your favorites, but for everyone. That might seem nuts, so to make it
    easier you might want to memorize generally whether a mobile has
    normal delay, fast delay, or slow delay. I'd call bo****, sate, jd,
    and lightning the fast delay mobiles. Nak and armor are slow. The
    rest you can think of as medium. By the way, add base delay to
    the shot delay in the next column to get the total delay.

    *If an enemy duals at the start of the game, they're using up a ton
    of delay. Depending on their mobile and how much time they spent
    aiming and firing... you might be able to actually get 3 turns in a
    row on them. Generally, look for a situation where the delay is
    between 1500 and 1600, or 1600+. If you use someone with a quick
    shot 1 like bo**** or sate, you can pound the enemy with shot 1, then
    another shot 1, then whatever you want.

    *Sometimes delay has to take a backseat to playing smart.
    For example, let's say there's a nice weather effect like a sunbeam
    or thor available. When you see those weather effects, it's almost
    always time to dual if you have a sure shot... because the added
    damage you get from force/thor is worth the big delay tradeoff.
    Also be aware of situations where a teammate can help you. Usually
    firing a dual during your first turn is bad because you'll give
    up 2 turns to the enemy, but if a teammate can dual and kill that
    enemy then it doesn't matter as much, does it?

    *The reverse of that situation... if you're going to get gangbanged
    by 2 enemies, and they've got sure shots and it's likely they can
    kill you... you probably shouldn't worry about playing delay. You
    should cut loose with a dual on your first turn because you're
    probably not going to get a 2nd turn (and who wants to go out with
    a piddly shot 1?).

    Advanced Delay Tricks

    *You may want to learn to use Dragshot if you haven't yet.
    Drag allows you to fire more quickly than slice (or sniper) and
    it's extremely accurate if you have the skill to use it.
    There will be situations where you need to fire as quickly as
    possible (less than 1 second) to beat someone's delay, and drag is
    sometimes the only way to do that.

    *When you're going first, and you have a shot 1 that you know is
    slower than your opponent's (i.e. you're armor and they're bo****)...
    you might want to use dual+ instead. You get 2 shots worth of damage
    and the fact that the bo**** is getting two turns in a row shouldn't
    bother you... since it was going to happen anyway.

    *Sometimes it's better not to worry about stealing a turn..
    for example you might be going 2nd and find that you have to shoot
    in less than a second to steal a turn. Even if you do steal that
    turn, you must then fire another shot 1 to avoid giving the enemy
    too much delay advantage. Instead of firing 2 fast shot 1s... you
    can just respond with a dual. You won't steal a turn, but with
    a big delay advantage (like having the 2nd shot at the start of the
    game) you can use a dual without giving up 2 turns in a row.

    *Some rooms don't allow anything but duals, so there isn't a lot of
    decisionmaking that goes with playing delay... one trick you can use
    (especially with mobiles that have strong shot 1's) is to do a dual
    shot 1 after the enemy opens with dual shot 2. You beat their delay
    and it's a bit more damage than simply firing a shot 2. It's useful
    when firing an SS or shot 2 might be awkward, for example when using
    turtle (who often must shotgun or high angle shot 2s) or nak (who
    sometimes cannot dual shot 2 because the ground has air pockets).

    *For some mobiles, dual+ with shot 2 first can have nice results.
    Cake/JD - if you can get the dual+ to approach at a high/steep angle,
    the shot 2 puts them in a small pit, then shot 1 makes a big crater
    underground. Done correctly, the enemy will have no way to shoot out
    of the pit because the ground blocks his shot.
    Armor - Sometimes armor can get the same results as cake with a
    perfectly placed shot 2 to start. Also, armor's shot 1 makes a large
    explosion and bunges the enemy a lot, which can cause the following
    shot 2 to miss. So if you use shot 2 first, that problem goes away.
    Raon - By firing shot 2 so that your mines land very near the center
    of the enemy mobile, you can follow with shot 1 and blow up the mines.
    You will get full shot 1 damage + at least partial shot 2 damage.
    Bigfoot - As with armor, shot 1 can move the enemy around a lot, so
    it might be safer to shotgun 2 first, then let 1 move them around.
    Nak - this is situation specific, and generally dual+ is useless for
    nak except to show off... but if you want to use it, try using shot
    2 first. The shot 2 goes first because it must land in front of the
    enemy, then after it hits it bunges them and the shot 1 can follow.

    *For cake and lightning, dual+ tends to be about the same damage as
    dual unless you get a weird lucky hit. So don't waste massive delay
    using a dual... except in specific situations like cake using dual
    shot 2 to bunge the opponent or lightning using dual 2 to hit several
    spread out targets.

    *If you prefer slice or god-forbid sniper, you should switch to
    dragshot for full power shots like shotguns, high angles,
    and bo**** hooks. Then you can just drag quickly to full power.
    Doing full power with slice/sniper wastes 3 seconds. Pressing
    escape constantly to switch modes sounds irritating, but after a
    while it's natural.

    *You can sort of set a 'delay trap' if you watch delay carefully
    enough. Look for situations where your delay is very close to
    the opponent's (like somewhere between -100 and +100) and try firing
    a shot 1. If your opponent takes the bait and fires back with a shot
    2, their delay will be so high you can get 2 turns in a row against
    them by using 1 again. If you ever see someone go from firing
    nonstop shot 2's to suddenly firing a shot 1... they might be setting
    the same trap on you, watch for it and switch to shot 1 yourself.
    Also look for situations where you have a very large advantage
    on the enemy, like +700. If you fire a shot 1 and they don't shot 1
    back, you may be able to steal a turn.

    *You can use delay to control (a bit) whether you or the enemy gets
    to make use of a particular weather effect... for example, let's say
    you're eighth on the turn list in a 4v4 game. The current weather
    effect is thor, the next effect is item lock. You might want to
    just dual now and not bother stealing a turn so you can make use of
    the thor, since stealing a turn and then having item lock means you
    don't have the chance to wipe out half their life anymore.
    Alternately, if the current weather effect is item lock and you can
    steal a turn vs an enemy, you can be the first to reach a strong
    weather effect like thor or force, and you may be able to kill them
    before they can strike back. It is even possible to deny an enemy
    the chance to get to use a weather effect... for example, in a 4v4
    game... if some enemy duals on the last round of a particular weather
    effect, and 2 or 3 people (friends or enemies) steal 2 turns in a row
    before he shoots again, then he will miss an entire weather effect
    because weather effects last only about 8 turns.

    *You can use F8 to skip your turn and have a little less delay than
    a fast shot 1 would use. Knowing this might allow you to control the
    weather in an important moment, like when the current turn is item
    lock and you're in a 1v1 vs an enemy who will kill you on his next
    turn. You can waste the turn to get rid of item lock, then on the
    next turn you can use your items to kill them and win. This is in
    rare situations where even your fastest shot 1 cannot get 2 turns.
    (thanks to angelsofgreeSW for this one).

    *Try not to dual just before double death (or whatever death mode) is
    going to activate. If you dual just before double death, enemies
    not only get 2 turns in a row on you, they get two DUALS in a row on
    you. You're pretty much guaranteed to die.

    *In score mode, the delay you die with follows you (a bit) when you
    come back. Usually you want to dual before you die, but sometimes
    to keep a lower delay it might make sense to go out with a dual+ or
    SS or something instead, especially if you know you can't kill the
    enemy. It might be the difference between spawning dead last on the
    delay list and spawning halfway up the list.

    *When an enemy is about to spawn in score, and it might be important
    to beat his delay... use shot 1. Often when people drop in they'll
    have a lot of delay, and using shot 1 will allow you to go before
    the enemy who spawned. Sometimes, after they've already dropped, you
    can use shot 1 and still get 2 turns in a row on them. Having 2
    people play delay like this and rape a freshly spawned enemy can allow
    you to kill someone without them ever getting to move or shoot.

    *It's not exactly delay, but it's related: When you choose where to
    drop in a score game, if you must drop near an enemy, try dropping
    near (or directly on top of) whichever enemy goes 4th on the delay
    list. That means you'll drop right on top of whoever shoots just
    before you come back, and that enemy is unlikely to be able to beat
    your delay because he just shot. It also means nobody else can shoot
    at you without hurting their teammate, so you can avoid getting raped
    before you have a chance to shoot. Just be aware that you are also
    preventing teammates from shooting that enemy if you drop on top of
    them. You may want to (rarely) wait for 1 turn to pass before
    dropping in score... that way you can safely land after an enemy's
    turn instead of just before they get to shoot.


    Ok, I think that's about it. Hope it helps people play smarter.

    By Creedo

  2. #2
    Roxane's Roadkill Reputation: 21
    Ramstien's Avatar
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    Holy hell thats what those numbers mean!?!?!?!

  3. #3
    Marios's Mustache Wax Reputation: 10

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    Angry kill

    FIGHT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:mad: :cool: :mad: :confused: :o

  4. #4
    Marios's Mustache Wax Reputation: 10
    CapnKs's Avatar
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    Nice. Very accurate. I've been playing GB since Thor's Hammer, and never knew turtle ate away 12 delay per second. Grats
    Live by the sword, die by the sword.
    IGN for Gunbound: CapnKs
    Leader of KsCrew. Rank requirement is Metal Battle Axe, unless you try out or have a special invitation from either the Luitenant or me.

  5. #5
    Still learning the ropes Reputation: 10
    peAceBoY's Avatar
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    tanx... thats very helpful
    :rolleyes: PeAceBoY:rolleyes:[IMG]

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