Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 27

Thread: New MMORPGs crashing and burning

  1. #1
    Marios's Mustache Wax Reputation: 10

    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    10
    Rep Power
    3

    Default New MMORPGs crashing and burning

    IN light of becoming bored and quitting another mmorpg, then later coming back to see only negative reviews on it, or it is infested with spammers, bots or became completely pay to win, why is this a trend? why are all the new mmorpgs doing so bad?
    we have(2013-current date)
    Aura kingdom aka Bot kingdom
    Black gold online, completely broken game
    Swordsman online, just came out already people are calling it pay to win and to be honest i found this game rather boring
    HeroesGo, closed down
    Dragons Prophet, this game was just terrible
    Ragnarok online 2
    etc(feel free to add more)
    so why are the MMORPGS that are new, coming out so bad?

  2. #2
    Roon's Rogue Reputation: 117
    coldReactive's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Madison, WI
    Posts
    4,291
    Rep Power
    11

    Default

    Because some developers don't want to take time and effort and some don't want to hear out the community. At the end of the day, it's all about money, not happiness.

    Only plays Magic DPS Classes, Healers and Machinist/Engineers.
    Playing MMO: FFXIV (Balmung)
    Waiting On: FFXV, KH3, Tree of Savior, RE:FFVII · Saving For: New Computer

  3. #3
    Link's a Hippie! Reputation: 15
    Skyrax's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    698
    Rep Power
    11

    Default

    The MMO audience has grown really large due to FFXI and WoW's popularity.

    When I think of old MMO's I see a lot of variety ex: Maplestory, Fairyland, Monster, Pristontale, Ragnarok, Shadowbane. If you look at those you can tell they have big fundamental differences. I think that now that the MMO audience has grown alot due to ffxi/wow etc, a lot of companies are coming into the market for money. A lot of these companies are blinded by the popular MMOs and end up creating half-assed MMOs with your modern typical 1-2-3-4-5 skills etc. They don't create anything special, because they are "copying". A copy will never have potential because it doesn't have it's own identity to become a full-fleshed game that feels complete and strong. I think this is why a lot of MMOs end up badly.

    However, there are still a lot of other interesting MMOs coming out and succeeding. I am waiting for the day where there will be a new MMO concept that will blow my mind.

    What coldReactive said is probably more true than what I did though.
    Last edited by Skyrax; 08-28-2014 at 12:39 AM.

  4. #4
    Roon's Rogue Reputation: 117
    coldReactive's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Madison, WI
    Posts
    4,291
    Rep Power
    11

    Default

    Indeed, some Developers are going to try the Sandbox approach, such as EverQuest Next. Regardless if EQN has PVP or not, I'm going to try it for that reason. (Plus, EQ2 is getting pretty Dated.) From what they showed of combat in EQN: Landmark, it's going to be a bit more action than traditional tab-target and Macros.

    Only plays Magic DPS Classes, Healers and Machinist/Engineers.
    Playing MMO: FFXIV (Balmung)
    Waiting On: FFXV, KH3, Tree of Savior, RE:FFVII · Saving For: New Computer

  5. #5
    Marios's Mustache Wax Reputation: 10

    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    10
    Rep Power
    3

    Default

    In my opinion copying some aspect are good, but if you take the good from the games that keep people online, for me that was perfect world's territory war, that was an amazing event, it had tactics, it involved a guild, it inspired lower levels to get up to the big leagues, small guilds to rise up. People need to look at what keeps players on these mmorpgs and try to implement that, combat of TERA, Territory war of PW, crafting of skyrim, instances like PW and tera(they were challenging and the rewards are fair for the amount of effort put in), some quest variance (not all kill x amount and return). i knwo this maybe impossible to find, hence why i am starting to learn programming and game development from scratch to maybe one day i can make such a game.

  6. #6
    Link's a Hippie! Reputation: 15
    Skyrax's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    698
    Rep Power
    11

    Default

    Yeah, I agree with you. I don't think my post was good. If you take a look at WoW, it copied a lot of things and became a really good well rounded game. I guess it's more like game developers aren't taking time to observe those other details that you're talking about and devote to making a real good game.

  7. #7
    Holy Hand Grenade Reputation: 26
    GenoX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    751
    Rep Power
    8

    Default

    Taking aspect of different mmorpg is a pretty flaw thing to do. It'll end up like those mmo's that just simply present a bunch of feature but the game isn't all that refreshing. All the legend (using legend because they were once immensely popular) games had their own twist to them. Which I believe is one of the reason that lead some of those game to being success. Most major failures are indeed letting marketing department run the game instead.

  8. #8
    Heads or Tails Reputation: 30
    Aktillum's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    334
    Rep Power
    6

    Default

    Games have been copying eachother with small differences since, well, the dawn of video games. Wolfenstein/Doom. Street Fighter/Mortal Kombat. Super Mario/Crash Bandicoot. Quake/Unreal Tournament. For a long time, people were okay with this.

    I can't quite put my finger on why MMOs are different in the sense that people expect truly innovative titles. I'm not defending MMOs, I hate the WoW-style grind and themepark MMOs, I just can't understand what sets MMOs apart from single-player / console games in the sense that MMOs are expected to be more innovative.

    I mean I sort of understand, like the FPS crowd. Some prefer Call of Duty despite the fact each sequel is identical to the last. Some prefer Battlefield because of the huge, open maps and vehicles and more realistic gameplay style. But they're both FPS games at the core.

    I think MMOs won't be really innovative until they're like...so sandboxy yet realistic at the same time, we're just simulating real life without the consequences of death. Hard to explain what I'm trying to say. Something like Grand Theft Auto meets Minecraft.

  9. #9
    Link's a Hippie! Reputation: 143
    yuniuninuniun's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    680
    Rep Power
    5

    Default

    small differences between those games were something new to experience
    MMOs trying to copy WoW aren't trying to do new things, but rather just copy WoW
    My feet hurt and I'm having trouble peeing.

  10. #10
    Heads or Tails Reputation: 30
    Aktillum's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    334
    Rep Power
    6

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by yuniuninuniun View Post
    small differences between those games were something new to experience
    MMOs trying to copy WoW aren't trying to do new things, but rather just copy WoW
    Yeah, that I understand. Like I said, I hate the WoW-clone themeparks. I can't think of something that would be truly innovative though. I'm friends with a game company CEO who recently turned down a $10million dollar budget to create a new MMO because, and I quote directly from him, he "doesn't know what the next big thing is". Nobody right now seems to know, thats why the market is in such a stalemate.

    Actually, let me copy/paste directly from Facebook;

    Matt Mihaly: I just yesterday decided to turn down ~$10 million that was being practically shoved at me to do literally whatever I want in games [...] I can't see what the next big thing is right now either.

    Matt Mihaly: And keep in mind I'm talking about games as a whole, not the MMO niche. Going back to the 80s we've gone through the 8-bit console era, the 16-bit console era, the rise of handheld, rise of the PC, rise of handheld, MMOs, virtual worlds, online casual games, social games, and mobile games. Reason I turned down the money is I have no idea what the big platform will be, and that's the important thing to me - otherwise you're just betting that you can make better content than everyone else who is trying to do the same thing as you, and that's not a very good bet generally without some kind of secret sauce that I don't think I possess.
    Last edited by Aktillum; 08-28-2014 at 04:21 AM.

  11. #11
    Holy Hand Grenade Reputation: 26
    GenoX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    751
    Rep Power
    8

    Default

    At the core all games in their respective genre are pretty much the same. I don't expect innovation from mmo's because it's rare and hard to come by, and in my opinion same with other genre's. Though I would guess sandbox element has become more of a factor. I mean in my experience in CoD: MW2, after playing the game for a while it is actually boring. It's nothing new just a better well made FPS at the time. Though once xbox 360 modders got a hold on the game it open a whole new level of entertainment. I play that game for a straight year. I normally don't stick to FPS for more than a month at most but when modded lobby's came out there was so much more varieties to the game.

    Though the problem is a lot of companies, developers, and publisher's make a lot of mmorpg that is literally nothing much different from one to the next. Console games tend towards more to story aspect of gamers. You wouldn't exactly play games like Sleeping Dogs thousands of hours if the next game had pretty much the same story and style and the game was practically the same.

    edit: Really what just reminded me when I typed that out was that it would be really interesting if mmorpg were more tended towards story's instead of the world itself. I mean I really liked how The Secret World had a lot of episodic like story content. Along with well thought out investigation quests.
    Last edited by GenoX; 08-28-2014 at 04:24 AM.

  12. #12
    Link's a Hippie! Reputation: 143
    yuniuninuniun's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    680
    Rep Power
    5

    Default

    That really sucks, especially if more people think that way.
    Right now people can't be turning down ideas. Companies need to leave their comfort zone to get to the next big thing and it doesn't seem like any are trying to do that.
    My feet hurt and I'm having trouble peeing.

  13. #13
    SuperKenshin's Servent Reputation: 31
    Luppi's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    1,046
    Rep Power
    8

    Default

    MMORPGs need to die for a few years so they can be reborn for the "no life" crowd again. Making an mmo too accessible takes the time sinks out, which in turn lowers your population thanks to everyone beating the end game in 2 months.

  14. #14
    Sandman's Slave Reputation: 80
    ASNZern's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    3,815
    Rep Power
    13

    Default

    The difference between WoW, and most other clones, is that.....

    Duh duh duhhh !!
    WoW copies from multiple games, and so WoW is better than all of those games.
    WoW Clones, on the other hand, are cheap copy of WoW itself. And so each of those clone is less than a half of a WoW. And that's why they bite the dust.

    There's nothing wrong with copying. We have awesome FPS, and RPG, and RTS from copying. But the success ones are the ones that become better from copying.
    It's WNxPyrZern. Pleased to meet you. My 3D Character Artist Folio

  15. #15
    Spyro’s Burning Cough Reputation: 43

    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    533
    Rep Power
    9

    Default

    Problem to me seems to be, that it has to focus on end game raids or nothing else. They tend to refuse to do much else or they do it in a way to not make enough of a focus on more interesting ways. Then it's not even just that-
    Take FFXI -FFXIV, there's a massive difference between the two and FFXI to Pre-Abyssea, Point i'm getting at using FFXI is that no one really supported it much before. Just really sucks ass, that was one of the few MMOs that was very group based to group up(and felt like an actual mmo), many ways to fix it but they took the easy way out. FFXIV felt alot like that, while XI was immersive, XIV not so much, there was boats/airships you had to wait for then wait on, nothing was instants till the Warps in XI, but even before that there was fishing on boats where you pull up mobs and have to fight them, and also encounters with pirates at times at times.
    Everything has become lets get there faster and not enjoy the game, it's become endgame and not enjoying the path to the end for loot, then just straight to end game.

  16. #16
    Marios's Mustache Wax Reputation: 10

    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    10
    Rep Power
    3

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by silent420 View Post
    Problem to me seems to be, that it has to focus on end game raids or nothing else. They tend to refuse to do much else or they do it in a way to not make enough of a focus on more interesting ways. Then it's not even just that-
    Take FFXI -FFXIV, there's a massive difference between the two and FFXI to Pre-Abyssea, Point i'm getting at using FFXI is that no one really supported it much before. Just really sucks ass, that was one of the few MMOs that was very group based to group up(and felt like an actual mmo), many ways to fix it but they took the easy way out. FFXIV felt alot like that, while XI was immersive, XIV not so much, there was boats/airships you had to wait for then wait on, nothing was instants till the Warps in XI, but even before that there was fishing on boats where you pull up mobs and have to fight them, and also encounters with pirates at times at times.
    Everything has become lets get there faster and not enjoy the game, it's become endgame and not enjoying the path to the end for loot, then just straight to end game.
    This reminds me of a tips someone told me to enjoy skyrim better, dont fast travel. Companies aren't thinking of the next big thing because they dont go to a source where people have random ideas, they dont want to bank on something new because they have no idea how the audience will react to it making a less safe investment. MMORPG must have end game yes, but the issue people make with all in my opinion, is having the game revolve around that, level 1-79 no challenge, then at level 80 you farm or buy your end game gears and then do what?, there is no content for the lower levels, just stuff to get you to max level as fast as possible, anyone here ever played PW before hyper stones and oracles? it would take months to hit 100 with the level cap being 105, level 89 was an accomplishment, but games i see now, 1 week MAX, not even no life-ing it you can reach max level, there is nothing to obtain at lower levels, which is why i stand firm against giving Armour and weapons in instances, it feels like i am just being given everything on a silver platter, not really working for it especially when the drops rates are so easy, so all in all, it's just companies making cookie cutter mmorpgs that are easy to get to level cap so you can spend money on end game gears.

  17. #17
    OnRPG Elite Member! Reputation: 139
    Rya.Reisender's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    5,655
    Rep Power
    10

    Default

    Most developers / publishers just do what brings them the most money and it seems to quickly develop MMORPGs and then milking out players and then closing it and launching a new one brings in a lot more money than trying to get a happy and stable playerbase.

    I mean it's the same for mobile games. If you release a good game for $20 and no in-app purchases, everybody complain about the high price and nobody buys it. You can sell it well for $5, but it won't bring in too much money. However, if you make it free, completely adjust the mechanics so they aren't very enjoyable for free and then put items that actually make it enjoyable as in-app purchases, you have plenty of people paying $100 or more for you game without complaining.

    No wonder that almost every developers/publisher aims for that these days.

    And the few developers who are too good hearted for that and rather be popular with the players just don't have enough money to realize their dream game or just don't get enough money from it to survive / keep updating it.

    Humanity gets just what they want. Crap games to throw money at. Because why else would those make the most money?

  18. #18
    Arri's Animal Reputation: 104
    The Great Beyond's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Midgard
    Posts
    3,108
    Rep Power
    11

    Default

    If you actually want some sort of quality in your game, you don't have that option in F2P MMOs. They will always be P2W and it's always about the money. People don't realize that you end up paying more in a F2P MMO than a monthly subscription fee of 10 to 15 dollars a month in a P2P. Sure, you can play a F2P without spending a dime, but you're going to end up struggling against those who have the pocket change to spare and just boost themselves and get ahead in the game.

    While this is entirely subjective, WoW & FFXIV:ARR are the best MMOs out right now, and they're both P2P. People are paying a monthly fee for the quality in these games, and they receive it. If they don't, they stop, and companies start losing money.
    Last edited by The Great Beyond; 08-28-2014 at 01:53 PM.

  19. #19
    Master Chief's Windex Reputation: 23
    MiRaJe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    87
    Rep Power
    11

    Default

    The fault is not in the developers but in the player base. When you've got people throwing money left and right at crappy games, they're going to keep making crappy games.

  20. #20
    Marios's Mustache Wax Reputation: 10

    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    10
    Rep Power
    3

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MiRaJe View Post
    The fault is not in the developers but in the player base. When you've got people throwing money left and right at crappy games, they're going to keep making crappy games.
    kinda like what's going on with music.....

  21. #21
    Link's a Hippie! Reputation: 143
    yuniuninuniun's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    680
    Rep Power
    5

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Velgus View Post
    kinda like what's going on with music.....
    except nobody buys music
    My feet hurt and I'm having trouble peeing.

  22. #22
    Chrono's Crony Reputation: 61
    SorenEmblem's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    3,360
    Rep Power
    13

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Velgus View Post
    kinda like what's going on with music.....
    Or any form of media. So long as there's a demand for bad games/music/movies/TV shows, there will be more bad games/music/movies/TV shows.

    The MMORPG genre is a fairly young genre, and it didn't really hit its popularity spike until the mid-late 2000's with WoW. Whenever a new genre gets a sudden spike in popularity, other companies will always try to hop on the bandwagon to make a quick buck. It's happened with other genres before; when the FPS genre reached the peak of its popularity during the Halo/CoD craze, I lost count of the amount of quick cash-in CoD clones that were being released. Similarly, in the 90's when the JRPG genre was at the peak of its popularity, everyone was trying to copy Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest in an effort to achieve the same success. As a younger genre, MMORPG's are going through a similar phase where everyone is trying to mimic the success of the popular titles in the genre in an effort to make easy money. Thus, the genre is becoming oversaturated, which will probably lead to a pseudo-crash in the MMO market before its popularity as a genre kind of levels out.

    Take FFXI -FFXIV, there's a massive difference between the two and FFXI to Pre-Abyssea, Point i'm getting at using FFXI is that no one really supported it much before. Just really sucks ass, that was one of the few MMOs that was very group based to group up(and felt like an actual mmo), many ways to fix it but they took the easy way out. FFXIV felt alot like that, while XI was immersive, XIV not so much, there was boats/airships you had to wait for then wait on, nothing was instants till the Warps in XI,
    Yes because everybody loves arbitrary wait times in their games /s


    Currently playing: FFXIV (Elucifer Arclight, Leviathan server), LoL (Trash Tier Waifu, NA server), SMITE (Zacewing)

  23. #23
    Link's a Hippie! Reputation: 143
    yuniuninuniun's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    680
    Rep Power
    5

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by SorenEmblem View Post
    Yes because everybody loves arbitrary wait times in their games /s
    Well boats for transportation were crazy fun in Maplestory. So long as they aren't just boats and have some sort of interaction on board then they're great.
    But without them you lose the feel of the connected world, and even walking to get to new places feels like a chore. It kind of just makes the player base lazier.
    My feet hurt and I'm having trouble peeing.

  24. #24
    Pellet Eater Reputation: 31
    Cripstar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    In a house, in my room.
    Posts
    599
    Rep Power
    10

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by silent420 View Post
    Point i'm getting at using FFXI is that no one really supported it much before. Just really sucks ass, that was one of the few MMOs that was very group based to group up(and felt like an actual mmo), many ways to fix it but they took the easy way out.
    Abyssea is what made me stop playing FFXI. Miss the old FFXI, maybe they'll release a Pre-Abyssea server someday, I'd resub for it.
    http://www.gameplank.tv/daeoc
    Come and stop by sometime, I stream just about every genre.

  25. #25
    Holy Hand Grenade Reputation: 26
    GenoX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    751
    Rep Power
    8

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by SorenEmblem View Post
    younger genre, MMORPG's
    You know I just realize in the mmorpg game scene, we're all becoming too fast pace. It have been about 20 years (possibly less) since the internet boom. Yet at the same time everything's becoming saturated in the MMORPG scene.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •