Senate fails to curb NSA's dictatorial survailance state

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    Default Senate fails to curb NSA's dictatorial survailance state

    The Nation of the United States is under attack and it has been struck by a harsh defeat in battle of freedom. This time, the decisive blow was landed by the US Senators, who decided against taking control of the National Security Apparatus. The wolfs will be kept of the leash while the world watches in fury and the citizens who made those decisions possible, the Americans ought to shoulder the blame. For this reason, I want to ask you all to share your opinion on the matter of the NSA instead of destabilizing just "things that will easily slide, because polls say no one knows what it's all about" they are going after "everything" now. How does it feel to pay for the tried and cherished process of replacing a democratically elected representation through a fascist puppet regime that has finally found it's way to America, "home" so to speak?

    There are a couple of points I want to highlight in respect to these things:
    - National security is a bait and switch. Why? Because perceived and actual security are not the same thing. The promise of the later will never be met, because there is no incentive whatsoever, as long as people buy into the scam of accepting the "perception", even when that is the officially used name of the game.
    - Psychological warfare has gone through many trials unscathed. People can be manipulated through dishonest information and when it's in advertising, for example the state will regulate it. The state is supposed to regulate psychological manipulation everywhere. Still the elected government will not exercise control here, even if the NSA sends representatives to lie under oath when questioned in their proceedings. That's because if you let these kind of weeds grow, the will overpower you and they did exactly that with public opinion. Facts that the number of people involved in working for the respective "3 letter agencies" of the security apparatus now shadows the number of regular police men in the US are unknown and do not spark a democratic process to correct that. This is happening because the democratic process in the US has been dismantled beyond repair.
    - The NSA is not under control of the state, which is a proxy for it's citizens. I am leaving the argument that this absence of control is exercised willingly aside btw. Rather I am arguing the following: The NSA is it's own boss now. Who will it work for? For it's former boss, that just fired himself, or for it's own needs and wants? Mind you that it's a true-bred attack dog and nothing else and it will rip apart and devour everything and everyone that falls before it's snout.
    - For all of this the US citizens get nothing. I wrote before about the perceived security, or better worded security perception, since it has nothing to do with security, or even better security deception, because the NSA is really doing it's very best to prove my point of not doing anything beneficial. They by now do not even bother to make up "success stories" anymore.
    - For this the US citizens give up their political voice. Mind you, that even though all of us here pride themselves on our skills in Lol in all it's relevant aspects, while maybe some of us have it in them to run a funny twitch stream, all the creative taunts are on public record. But what does that matter? It's far to specific. The "metadata" fact that people on here are gamers is already filed away and in storage, because it's just one piece of the puzzle needed to character assassinate someone.
    - This also goes for any political representant you may once hope to take a stand for your needs in those fighting pits in Washington. It also was true for the people who are already sitting in those senate chairs and which threw the idea of taking charge and doing their jobs out.

    Now that I have arrived at the end of my lamenting rant and in whilst thinking of all the torturing and the droning of civilians and the world policing that is just a crusade against self-determined freedom globally and all those invasions and soldiers abroad and all that propaganda and prosecution of dissent, that over a tenth of the budget is going into, a tenth of every woman and mans taxes; What do you Userz think about that?
    How can it be that people go about saying "Murica" and all that crap without getting a slap on the wrist? How can it be that all that violence is "awesome" and everybody is not spitting in the face of people glorifying all of this? Finally how can people not demand this stopped?
    How can the not fathom that they are drawing a loosing hand and that they are the actual target?
    Why are Americans so ****ing stupid?


    (crosspost from reddit, lol just kidding, obviousely)
    Last edited by Ronin; Yesterday at 07:41 PM.

    Stay frosty.

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    Last edited by NSA_Guy; 05-23-2015 at 11:40 AM.

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    NSA pls......



    (I also had a part planed where I'd produce some more illegible blocks of text concerning how the **** it's possible, that people see fox news as "American", since it's the most unamerican thing there could be on the planet and how the Americanism needs a revival from it's roots in like the early 19th century, where it actually meant something (not the segregation parts). That train of thought isn't structured enough in my head for now. The US needs to go back to those times, where it was a force for peace. Not that kind of peace it goes for now, where you restart the cold war, destabilize countries because gas pipelines run through them or are in planing and playing carrot on a stick with iran... Note that much of that goes for the EU too, which should take a bite out of that period of American ideals, not the neocon moneyflood warmachine intnl banking BS.)
    Last edited by Ronin; 05-23-2015 at 11:55 AM.

    Stay frosty.

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    So it this good or bad?
    Flattery will get you anything you want

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    If you believe Snowden, the NSA is more than just a failure. He stated that the information about the 9/11 attacks was able to be gathered from pre-NSA sources, but the information was lost in the muddle of the information acquired by the NSA. Something like making it harder to look for a needle in a haystack since they kept piling on more hay.

    So it invades American privacy while harming anti-terrorism. Come to Canada, we just have permanent records of non-conviction.
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    I just wonder if people don't care because
    - the post is too damn long
    - they think I am too much of a trollish dick
    - they don't care
    - all of the above

    The thread went kinda like I expected anyways. I seem to be bad at making threads.

    Stay frosty.

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    Totalitarian State is able to field a stronger military with soldiers who are more willing to die for the sake of nationalism than a democratic country. Now that the world's oil reserves are about to expire, it is important for the powers that be (filthy rich people) to prepare for world domination rather than self-sustainability. We are a very tribalistic, cruel, and aggressive species. Colonialism is our way of life and the ideals of equality that are inherent to Democracy will often be shunned by the powerful. The more warfare that occurs, the less competition there will be for the survivors' offspring, so it may even be beneficial for privileged people to support widespread war and poverty since it's beneficial to their gene pool when they are not affected by widespread loss of life. But I think the main factors are human greed and human stupidity. People seldom consider the longterm effects of their actions, and the American paradigm is to have an omnipotent super-power watching over us, which may be a reason why people just don't care. Another reason why people just don't care is because they feel powerless, or because they think that they can ****ing wreck this planet because Armageddon will reset everything.
    Last edited by Phenoca; 05-25-2015 at 07:44 PM.
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    Thread needs better formatting, with more key points in bold to grab the shorter attention spans of the Internet. Besides half our users are Europeans that already know the American systems are broken, and don't have any interest in helping us pull ourselves out of this nonsense situation.

    Point being, given all that knowledge, what are we supposed to do about it? Do you have any first step in mind?
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    Quote Originally Posted by DizzyPW View Post
    Point being, given all that knowledge, what are we supposed to do about it? Do you have any first step in mind?
    I'd try crying. Crying solves a lot of problems for my little sister, who knows might work here too.
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    It's all possible in 3 simple steps.
    - The metadata-program needs to die.
    - The intel agencies must be brought under control and oversight of the executive branch and the judiciary branch.
    - Secrecy must be limited.

    Concerning meta-data:
    It has 2 flaws: It shows you enemies that are not enemies. It also doesn't show you the enemies that are the enemies.

    The number of false positives exceeds the number of true hits, if the percentage of hits is small, even with marginal error rates. If anyone is interested, I can do the mathematical example, but I already posted it on the topic of drones here. Basically for every terrorist the drone program kills, between ten and a hundred innocent people die on average. Since there are no means to evaluate the individual cases, no one even knows how many.
    That brings us to problem two: The meta data is only data. Data is not information. Data becomes information through context. The information however is never gathered. Example: Every killed able male in Afghanistan is counted as an enemy combatant, if not proven to be an innocent uninvolved civilian. Since the attempt of a prove is never planed in, the drone program is more or less genocide. I did think through 4 times, if I want to put it that way, but there have been people convicted in den Hague for less extreme measures of war. As long as the assumption stands that there are terrorists in Afghanistan, the meta-data will point you to someone and flag him with a probability. That is why courts do not use probabilities; It only ends when everyone is dead.

    Concerning oversight:
    That one is obvious, but seemingly not to the Senate. Either the US runs the NSA and CIA, or they run the US. There is no middle ground.

    Secrecy must be limited:
    This actually goes to the heart of the problem of the credibility of the US around the world. The US convicts North Korea of hacking Sony, but with what credibility? No one can believe them, if their capabilities are unknown and their procedures are clandestine. Now there is a place for secrecy, but not on the diplomatic floor. Everything the US says about the Ukraine, China, Russia, North Korea, Israel, Pakistan, Japan, the EU... Everything is stained by the fact that it has a large probability of being fabricated. If the US wanted to be the good guy again, it could call out others with moral credibility, if the information collected would be from transparent sources. (It mustn't be, if the US had credibility, because of trustworthiness. It's not and it hasn't and this, it only can be.)
    Clandestine intelligence is a matter of self-defense, but not on a national level. Invading other nations on the basis of information that is obscure enough to be a secret is frankly put a very morbid joke.

    The fourth and most important point remains:
    War is not a tool for leveraging elections. Americans ought to educate themselves that Democracy is only good when it's boring.

    In closing:
    The terrorist threat doesn't exist anyways. Even after deaths going into millions now and more and more nations slowly drifting into chaos, it's all Bullshit. Even closing the NSA and CIA down would not make this made up danger real. (As if they where functional.)
    Last edited by Ronin; Yesterday at 01:08 AM.

    Stay frosty.

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