those two games are far from pay to win, and those so called pay to win games are also not pay to win, it's just an excuse coming from losers who don't realize their lack of skill. oh i just lost because this guy has a cash item with 500 more attack QQ pay to win!!! whining about cash shop oh really.. it's only natural that cash shop should make things easier but they're still beatable. in certain games cash shop users are bad at pvp.